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ITS THE MIXDOWN THREAD!

#51
scope Wrote:actually many of the worlds top engineers are currently of the mindset that they will use daw automation envelopes and curves in preference to compression to control peaks and transients

Xyxthumbs

Baffled where's funxion? i mean, he's the resident greek on this board, ain't he? Nervous
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#52
scope Wrote:actually many of the worlds top engineers are currently of the mindset that they will use daw automation envelopes and curves in preference to compression to control peaks and transients

Xyxthumbs

Xyxthumbs

yeah man, chopping audio and dropping the big peaks is the way to go for natural sound, deffo Xyxthumbs compresison has it's uses, but it is only an automatic (but sound-altering) way of doing the same thing. not that i am one of 'the worlds top engineers' Hahaha

nice to see you about, scope Wave
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Don Cherry Wrote:Every human is blessed in her or his life with one love (passion), no matter how long it may last. This Absolute love will last in one's heart and soul forever.
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#53
likewise mate, just having a 10 min break from work !
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#54
Questions : (for those who mixdown on software)


do you inevitably transfer (dump) all vst tracks to audio before your FINAL mixdown?

what are the advantages/disadvantages to each approach? (ie. all audio for mixdown vs. some audio and some midi)

do you lose any audio quality when making a midi > audio transfer?

if you do decide to transfer from midi > audio before a mixdown, do you have to optimise the amplitude of every track before you do it? or is it ok to normalise everything post-dump?
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#55
dodz Wrote:do you inevitably transfer (dump) all vst tracks to audio before your FINAL mixdown?

Not if my CPU is doing well enough to handle the entire project, specifically including said VSTi and any plugins treating it. What's the point?

Quote:what are the advantages/disadvantages to each approach? (ie. all audio for mixdown vs. some audio and some midi)

No advantages per se other than CPU usage consideration. It's whether it bothers you to have your computer bleeding at 95% or not. Having everything as audio gives room for more plugins, yes, but if your tune is done (this is a mixdown thread after all), it's only a question of having your CPU at say 40% rather than 95%.

BFD!

Quote:do you lose any audio quality when making a midi > audio transfer?

Theory says no, assuming you mix down to 24/32bit-floating point and the same sample rate you are using, which is what VSTi's work at. 32bit FP is 24 bit plus 8 bits for levels +0dB as I recall.

Quote:if you do decide to transfer from midi > audio before a mixdown, do you have to optimise the amplitude of every track before you do it? or is it ok to normalise everything post-dump?

Baffled It isn't necessary to normalise everything - remember, with VSTi's, noise isn't a consideration, only resolution is. It's not like when you record guitar too quiet and then turn it up to find it smothered in nasty noise!

That said, it does make a difference. If you mix down to (min) 24 bit, you can 'record' a VSTi well quiet, then wang it up without losing very much at all in the way of quality. 16 bit is different - record a VSTi to 16 bit, peaking at -60dB max, then normalise that, and you'll hear the shabby 'bitcrush' sound.

So in a nutshell, if you are going to bounce VSTi's to audio, bounce to 24 bit and make sure they are giving a decent level (the same principle as normal recording) - but because of the extra resolution 24bit gives at low levels, you can have a VSTi peaking at whatever, like -10dB, without worrying about noise or bit-depth related resolution issues.

Normalisation is surplus to requirements in my 'studio'. I never ever use it.
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Don Cherry Wrote:Every human is blessed in her or his life with one love (passion), no matter how long it may last. This Absolute love will last in one's heart and soul forever.
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#56
big topic this !!
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#57
thanx macceroni! makes sense. Xyxthumbs


now send me an email you scallywag.
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#58
next question :


do you mixdown from scratch? (ie. start fresh) or is your tune usually 'done' once you've finished the assemblage/writing process? (ie. mix as you go, and then 'fine tune' at the end)


as no doubt you grow accustomed to your 'rough mix' as you're actually making the tune, it seems wiser to reset all your volume envelopes and panning etc (wacky manglation automations could probably just stay) and start from the ground up again, no?
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#59
:soaks up some knowledge:
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#60
scope Wrote:big topic this !!

Small answer that !!

:P Teef
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Don Cherry Wrote:Every human is blessed in her or his life with one love (passion), no matter how long it may last. This Absolute love will last in one's heart and soul forever.
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#61
Cool Thread! Cool

I always mix externally and master straight to CD.
there seems to be feck all head room when I try to mix internally.
Methinks I need more practice.
Definitly more head room using an analogue desk though.
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#62
back from the depths....
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#63
dodz Wrote:next question :


do you mixdown from scratch? (ie. start fresh) or is your tune usually 'done' once you've finished the assemblage/writing process? (ie. mix as you go, and then 'fine tune' at the end)


as no doubt you grow accustomed to your 'rough mix' as you're actually making the tune, it seems wiser to reset all your volume envelopes and panning etc (wacky manglation automations could probably just stay) and start from the ground up again, no?

ive been staring at this screen waiting for someone to answer this question for more than 16 months...can someone do me a favour and answer it so i can go to bed.

fanks.
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#64
Diverse Concept Wrote:
dodz Wrote:next question :


do you mixdown from scratch? (ie. start fresh) or is your tune usually 'done' once you've finished the assemblage/writing process? (ie. mix as you go, and then 'fine tune' at the end)


as no doubt you grow accustomed to your 'rough mix' as you're actually making the tune, it seems wiser to reset all your volume envelopes and panning etc (wacky manglation automations could probably just stay) and start from the ground up again, no?

ive been staring at this screen waiting for someone to answer this question for more than 16 months...can someone do me a favour and answer it so i can go to bed.

fanks.

i always mix on the go through out the process of making the track , some times you add a new element and have to re adjust the whole lot but i find it much easier to have a idea how you want it to be as your working.
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#65
both.

with my own stuff, Ill mix as I go along, and if when the time comes if I think it would benefit from a fresh approach then I might wack all the faders down, bypass most FX and processors, and build again, with a different end goal in mind.

if its a clients project, that they bring and im also recording vocals then Ill understand the sound they want to go for (sometimes I''ll ask them to tell me some records that they like the sound of that they see working on this project), record everything in from their MPC or whatever, or import their audio tracks, build an approximate mix in the right direction, good enough to give the performer a good vibe to go from, record the vocals, then most times start to replace the processors and FX with better sounding stuff, more finely tuned into the sound Im going for and go from there

if its a clients project that either has no vocals, or has them already recorded, again I'll get an idea of the sound they have in mind, if any, and i might make suggestiins in this respect, then record everything in from their MPC or whatever, or import their audio tracks, zero everything, and build the mix from scratch.
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#66
I build my mix as I go, but don't usually mix down until I have put it on my walkman, heard it before/after/between other things, on other systems blah blah Smile

These days I am getting better at being objective, that is, I can put my cans on and hear what's wrong with a mix within seconds. As if my cans were absolutely neutral/flat etc etc (which they are far from being, although I love their sound).

Jig
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Don Cherry Wrote:Every human is blessed in her or his life with one love (passion), no matter how long it may last. This Absolute love will last in one's heart and soul forever.
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#67
It's pretty much impossible to not mix while you make the tune. I would think that it would sound like crap if you didn't adjust volume/eq here and there. Although, after doing that, it is good to mix down at the end. Fix EQ on each track to sit right in the mix, go over and check all volumes just in case. You may think it sounds perfect, but if you go through and check some things, it might sound even better. Then again, if you don't know what you are doing it could do some damage.

Always save multiple versions of the project just in case. Whenever you make a major change or are about to mix down, save as version _02, _03, etc. It will save you.
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#68
bump
good
read
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#69
oh yeah....this thread!
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#70
Some good advice here
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#71
macc Wrote:2) have drums showing at max -6db on the master fader when they are solo'ed, more or less the same for bass, maybe a touch less. everything else is just parsley. then you know your drums are taking up half the headroom Xyxthumbs (which is what i want anyway Icon_razz :d ). use the waves l1 or l2 to prevent anything going over that.


Xyxthumbs apart from that last sentence Lol .

i start by setting up a few bus tracks, putting a long reverb on one, short general reverb on another, maybe a tape delay on the 3rd.
all channel faders on -infinity. bring the kick upto -6dbish, and eq + compress. do the same with the snare, hat, then overheads. sending a bit of snare to the reverb busses.
basically my mixdowns go like this,

faders
pan pots
eq
compression
reverb + delays
automation

and work by that in a loop for each instrument.
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#72
you dont find it better to have the compression there from the start so you can 'mix into' the comp/comps? Smile

not that i think your ways wrong, ive always just mixed into compression rather than add it later on....

on a per track and if i use some comp on the master channel of the mix basis
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#73
macc Wrote:use the waves l1 or l2 to prevent anything going over that.


bwaahahahahaahahahahahahaha Teef
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#74
Hahaha

some poor advice here

I understand headroom in a digital sytem much better now Oops
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Don Cherry Wrote:Every human is blessed in her or his life with one love (passion), no matter how long it may last. This Absolute love will last in one's heart and soul forever.
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#75
drums @ -7?
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